Cheap Trick's Rick Nielsen Talks To KTVU.com

To hear about how much Cheap Trick currently has on its plate as a band, one has to wonder if the Chicago-based quartet might have taken on a bit too much. The band is in the middle of a major summer tour with Def Leppard and Poison, and -- unlike many bands from the '70s that have fallen into the category of "nostalgia act" -- also has a self-released album of new songs entitled "The Latest" that the group got on record store shelves this past July without the support of a record label.

Additionally, Cheap Trick recently documented their own 40th Anniversary tribute to the classic Beatles album 'Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band' with a CD and DVD released Aug. 25. The sound on the two releases was engineered by Geoff Emerick, the same man who engineered 'Sgt. Pepper's' for The Beatles alongside producer George Martin. And if that isn't enough, the band also cut a new track for the soundtrack of this summer's blockbuster 'Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen.'

In mid-September, they'll reprise their Beatles tribute for a nine-day run of performances at The Las Vegas Hilton. The band is also slated to contribute to the soundtrack for 'Iron Man 2,' the anticipated sequel that comes to theaters in summer of 2010. Guitarist and main songwriter lo these many years, Rick Nielsen has been the driving force behind Cheap Trick since they first came together in Rockford, Illinois, in 1974. Despite the fact that he's no spring chicken (Nielsen says he was born in 1948; you do the math), he's not slowing down one bit. I caught up with the charming and very funny guitar slinger on one of his days off from the big summer tour just to see how the band is holding up.

KTVU.com: Well, I was just looking at all the stuff you have going on this summer -- from the big tour to the new album that's getting lots of praise from critics and fans, the 'Sgt. Pepper's' Vegas shows, CD and DVD, and the 'Transformers 2' soundtrack. I hear Cheap Trick will also be on the upcoming 'Iron Man 2' soundtrack. Is that right?

Rick Nielsen: We're working on some music for the game -- oh, 'Iron Man 2.' Yeah, I think we're on that, too.

KTVU.com: That's awesome. But when do you guys sleep, man? You guys are busy.

Rick Nielsen: Well, you know...[laughs] I guess I never think about it. It's not like we're working 24/7, but there's enough projects going on that keeps us from getting too bored, I guess. We're not calling looking for work; work calls us.

KTVU.com: It's interesting, you guys used to do a lot of movie soundtrack work in the past. Has it coming full circle? Are you getting a lot of calls again?

Rick Nielsen: Well, it's just been kinda steady on and off, really. It's a combination of "Gee, we want Cheap Trick" or "Gee, we want the song that Cheap Trick did." Like with [Comedy Central show] 'The Colbert Report' with Steven Colbert, we were his first choice [to perform the program's theme song]. I don't know what other choices there were, but they came to us said, like the old U.S. Army slogan, "We want you."

KTVU.com: Well, when you want the best...

Rick Nielsen: Yeah, I mean, we didn't say "No" or "I don't know, we're a little too busy here, Steven..." But, you know, if they didn't like what we were doing they wouldn't use it. It's like "That 70's Show," there was a toss up between using the song "In The Street" or using the song "Surrender." So they picked "In The Street" with some other group or guy doing the song.

So the first year goes by and they said, "Well, we should have used the Cheap Trick song." But they couldn't change the song so they came to us and said "Can you guys do it?" OK, so we changed the arrangement, but we still had to have the same tempo and we added the "We're all alright" at the end. And we did a video with them and I said "Well, I guess we should have been the first choice."

KTVU.com: Yeah, definitely. It's interesting how some of those decisions get made.

Rick Nielsen: In that movie "Joe Dirt," the whole movie goes by and finally, in the last minute or so, I guess the director or the producer thought it was the perfect song to use at this spot. It ends with "If You Want My Love." And they use the whole song. Usually when they put music in movies, they use just a little tidbit. But they used the whole thing in this one, just at the very end. I kinda made a joke sometimes when we would do it live "Well, here's a song, it's in this great movie -- but you gotta wait until the last two minutes of the movie to hear us [laughs]. But the music actually dictated where it should be and that was the spot. So...I don't know what I'm rambling on about, but...

KTVU.com: [Laughs] For the unwashed masses, tell the readers of KTVU.com why they should rush out right now and buy the new Cheap Trick CD titled "The Latest."

Rick Nielsen: Ummmm...[long pause]...Because every night when I'm onstage, I say "Thank you for making 'The Latest' the number one record in the world...on 8-track." [laughs}. We're number one in the world, right now. In 8-track sales.

KTVU.com: Now, you know there is someone in the United States who still listens to 8-tracks. You've just given them something new besides the first two Boston albums to listen to, and they're happy about that.

Rick Nielsen: Yeah, there you go...

KTVU.com: What songs from 'The Latest' are you playing on tour?

Rick Nielsen: Uh... (long pause)

KTVU.com: "Sick Man (of Europe)?"

Rick Nielsen: Yeah, "Sick Man" of course, we do that every night. Another one we've been doing every night is "These Days." We do [sings] "When The Lights Are Out" and "Miss Tomorrow." We've done those four for sure, I mean we don't do them every night but we do at least two from the new album every night.

KTVU.com: And how is the crowd responding? Are you getting the response you want from the new stuff?

Rick Nielsen: Yeah, you know, Robin is such a good singer...

KTVU.com: No, he's THE BEST singer. I'm sorry. I hate to contradict you, Rick, but I guess you don't mind that one too much.

Rick Nielsen: No, I don't mind that one. But we learned a lesson. If you're gonna play a new song, make sure it's about two minutes long.

KTVU.com: That's actually a good lesson. And also a good segue into my next question. I love the song "Every Day You Make Me Crazy," but I understand that song has its origins in a Pepsi jingle. How did that make the leap from jingle to song on the album?

Rick Nielsen: Well, that was an idea, at one point; a song idea. And it wasn't a commercial at that point, but I write everything like it's going to be a Pepsi or McDonald's commercial [laughs].

KTVU.com: Well, when you put it that way, that actually makes a hell of a lot of sense. That's pretty smart thinking.

Rick Nielsen: Well, parts of it were from a thing that I wrote that I wanted to be under consideration for the record. I mean, the lyrics were changed; the guitar parts, too. But it was an idea of something else and the way the whole album was done. I mean, it was like it was done like a trilogy: 3,3,3,3,3 and then one - for some reason we had an extra song.

But getting back to that song, we just thought "Why do you have to have a guitar solo? Why do you have to make the song 4 minutes long?" It doesn't have to be. It's like our song, "Hello There." It was basically a sound check, you know? Because we didn't have an opening song. What song do you start with when you've got one album or two albums, but no real solid set opener? So I wrote the song as a sound check.

KTVU.com: That's interesting> I hadn't heard that about "Hello There" before.

Rick Nielsen: Yeah. And so the idea for "Every Day You Make Me Crazy" is really just a short ditty to get an idea across. All songs do that. But like I said, every song, really, is a commercial. It should be a commercial for your TV station.

KTVU.com:[laughs] That's a good idea. I like that.

Rick Nielsen: [singing) "Every Day You Make Me K-T-V-U dot com..."

KTVU.com: Dude! Obviously you are the marketing brains behind Cheap Trick, but I see a consulting gig in your future...

Rick Nielsen: Ha!

KTVU.com: I'm not saying you need to stop playing. Don't get me wrong...

Rick Nielsen: Yeah, well, I've been thrown out of worse places...

KTVU.com: I love it. Don't think I won't be throwing that little re-write of "Every Day" in front of somebody today. Someone from the station will call you, I'm sure...

Rick Nielsen: [singing again to the tune of "Every Day"] K-T-V-U dot com...I think like that. Really, when I was a kid, I remembered "Aren't you glad you use Dial? Don't you wish everybody did?" When I heard that, I was like "Aren't you glad you use Dial? Don't you wish you owned the company?"

KTVU.com: [laughing]

Rick Nielsen: I'd change junk like that. There are certain ads on TV that just beg for someone to toy with them. They beg to be toyed with the way everyone knows they ought to be. There's one ad I like; what's the one? Where the guy comes down on the hover craft?

KTVU.com: Oh, um, Orbitz.

Rick Nielsen: Yeah, and it's like "You're all going to get a check. But you're not." I like the ones where it's not all a happy ending, you know? It reminds me of Stan Freberg.- I don't know if you know who Stan Freberg is...

KTVU.com: Yeah.

Rick Nielsen: Stan Freberg was one of my favorite comedians. His kid was the one selling encyclopedias on TV, Encyclopedia Britannica. I used to buy his LPs along with Shelley Burman. But I like commercials. I always dreamt them up my way.

KTVU.com: Cheap Trick has an incredibly healthy presence online at www.cheaptrick.com and a great fan base there. I'm wondering if you ever look at the site and try to interact with all that's there?

Rick Nielsen: Yeah, well, the fact that we're still doing it...I mean it's like we're mining our own gold. We didn't tape sound checks or video tape sound checks years ago knowing that the internet was going to be here. But we did do those things and content is king. It used to be cash is king, but now it's content. And with however many internet radio stations or TV stations there are, I don't think anyone wants to hear Cheap Trick 24/7. But two hours out of 24 'ain't bad, you know?

KTVU.com: Yeah.

Rick Nielsen: So, yeah, we do work on it, but we have Twitter, we have Facebook, YouTube...I'd just be spending way too much time."Here's what Rick had for breakfast today." And I'd rather have someone else think, act, talk on my behalf. And even after all these years, all these bands call the Internet fertile ground for this, that, and the other. But my name is still misspelled half the time [laughs].

KTVU.com: [laughing with Rick, not at Rick]

Rick Nielsen: Even our own record company, years ago, "Rick Nelson" they put on a record...

KTVU.com: Yeah, I remember that. "Standing On The Edge" it was...

Rick Nielsen: Yeah, and it actually took them extra time to do it wrong. I'm old enough as it is, but Rolling Stone always listed my birthday as two years earlier than it is. I was born in 1948 which is old enough but they always put in 1946. Finally, in the Rockford newspaper where Bun E. and I still live, Bun E. finally threatened the paper. He said, "Look, if you put Rick's birthday wrong again, we'll never do another interview with you again."

Because all that does is confuse people. If someone does research they are likely to think the local paper has it right and they get it wrong and it just goes on and on. So they printed a big retraction and all that and about six months after "It'll never happen again," it happened again.

KTVU.com: Geez. Well, I know this sounds horrible, but there are some people who just don't care about getting it right. I mean, some people will dismiss something like that by saying "Well, they are from way back in the day, does it matter if we get it right?"

Rick Nielsen: Well, yeah, but even if we took away all those people who say "They are old and they suck," there are still those people who say "Your careers are over, you're old and washed up and you'll never get anywhere." And that's just our wives talking.

KTVU.com: [laughing to the point of not being able to breathe] But pound for pound, Cheap Trick is the best live band out there. Still.

Rick Nielsen: There you go. Shows you how crummy everybody else is if we're number one...

KTVU.com: Well, I'll tell you, everyone else must be crummy...

Rick Nielsen: Well, you know, we're pretty old school. We go out and play. We don't edit anything; we don't enhance anything. We don't put "fix-it" machines on everything we do. But if you see us dancing onstage, that's not us. Those are real dancers. But we are the real thing. We've made every mistake there is, but it's rock music. It's not supposed to be perfect. When I see bands that try to "Get it right," [I wonder] what is that? What is "right?" We're a real American rock band. Power pop does not scare me.

KTVU.com: I like that name. That designation "power pop." I don't know why.

Rick Nielsen: Yeah, power pop is cool, but it's kinda like saying you're a punk band. Hell, there was only one punk band, you know? The Sex Pistols were punk to me. They were cool enough and they were irreverent enough, and Johnny Rotten didn't turn out to be some nice guy in the end.

KTVU.com: No, he didn't.

Rick Nielsen: He's still a jerk, you know? That's cool. Sid Vicious, every picture of him, he looks worse than the picture before it. And I love it, you know? He didn't change.

KTVU.com: Why does the black and white checkerboard design figure so prominently into Cheap Trick's brand? Is that symbolic of anything?

Rick Nielsen: Well, when I was a kid -- well, I'm still a kid -- but when I was a kid watching TV, I used to call it "The Bug Races." At ten o'clock at night, there were only three stations [and] all the stations went off the air. And there used to be a symbol, you know? "The Indian," [was] this Indian head on the TV screen when they all signed off. And then even that would go away and you'd get all this static [makes white noise sounds].

And that was "The Bug Races." And I used to look at the TV like "The Twilight Zone" like there was going to be some alien coming out of there, if you keep watching there was going to be some message coming across from outer space [laughs]. And that was way before they were looking for extra terrestrial life in different galaxies. But if you look close, all that static is just black and white circles. Actually, in Japan and Europe, instead of the little circles that make up our pixels, they're actually squares and rectangles over there. That's why their picture quality is better. So, that's where I kinda got it. I liked it. It looked good. It was M.C. Escher without too much work.

KTVU.com: It's a pretty brilliant stroke of branding because just about anyone familiar with Cheap Trick, when they see a black and white checkerboard pattern, you automatically think of Cheap Trick. I've walked into an old 1950's style building with the black-and-white checkerboard linoleum floor and thought, "Hey, it's a Cheap Trick floor."

Rick Nielsen: Yeah, they copied us before we started it. One of the houses I had -- this place that was built in 1854; it was on the national register of historical homes...

KTVU.com: Is this your current house?

Rick Nielsen: No, it's the house I had before the one where I live now. I put a black-and-white checkerboard bathroom in with a prison urinal and a prison sink, meaning it just had buttons you could push, you couldn't just rip off the nozzle and terrorize me in there. But it had prison handles, prison controls, black-and-white checkerboard floor and walls and urinal. And that was good, especially back then because -- I quit drinking about 9 or 10 years ago...

KTVU.com: Good for you, man...

Rick Nielsen: Oh, yeah, I haven't had a drink in 10 years. God am I thirsty...

KTVU.com: [laughs]

Rick Nielsen: But, you know, when people get hammered, guys, anyway, they have a tendency to use the floor and the walls as much as the actual commode. So I said "Let's not make it lavish and then expect it's not going to happen. Let's make it like everyone's gonna spill. I don't know what that has to do with anything, but I've done so many walls and floors and stainless steel urinals. You know, there's "The Wailing Wall?" Well, we have "The Weeing Wall." So you just take a hose and spray the place down because it's so disgusting...

KTVU.com: [laughs] OK, before we get too far gone, I wanted to ask you a question about working with John Lennon on the 'Double Fantasy' sessions. What is something you've never told anyone about that session?

Rick Nielsen: Um...it was good...

KTVU.com: No, come on, dude, you've told that story before.

Rick Nielsen: Yoko said to John when we were in there [imitates Yoko] "John, I think we should do it faster or maybe we should do it slower." And he says "Well Mother," because he always called her "Mother," so he says, "Well, Mother, why don't you do it fast -- and then we'll do it slow." [Imitates Yoko in a high pitched, shrill, tone] "[Expletive] you, John! [Expletive] you!" [laughs] So there you go. There was one.

KTVU.com: That must have been the craziest session ever.

Rick Nielsen: It was interesting, because that's the only session I ever did where my wife gave me the hall pass for the day off. That was the day my third son was born. And I wasn't in the delivery room because I knew about this happening. She said "It's John Lennon and I know that's a big deal for you." Believe me if it was McCartney I'd have been in the delivery room.

KTVU.com: [laughing]

Rick Nielsen: [also laughing] That's true! Lennon was the one.

KTVU.com: Cheap Trick is such a highly revered band, so highly regarded by musicians, critics and fans all over the world -- why is it you guys always take the opening slot on these big arena tours? Last year it was Journey and Heart, this year it's Def Leppard and Poison. And -- all due respect to all the bands on your summer tour this year -- but Poison should be opening for Cheap Trick, right?

Rick Nielsen: Okay.

KTVU.com: I'm sure you'll have that changed by tomorrow...

Rick Nielsen: OK, whatever. No, no, it's really just that's what we are offered and we'll take it. Not everybody can close the show.

KTVU.com: Sure.

Rick Nielsen: And, it's the position we were offered and it's a good spot. And we get more sympathy this way. No, no, I have no idea.

KTVU.com: So that was a situation where it's just what you were offered so you took it.

Rick Nielsen: We got some apologies from Def Leppard. Joe Elliot called me up and said "Rick, you know, I wish it weren't set up like this." But...it is and it's not the end of the world. You know, somebody's gotta open the show and they didn't offer to switch with us.

KTVU.com: They could have, but they didn't. People don't always do the right thing...

Rick Nielsen: Yeah, really. But, it's all good, you know? If you have a festival and you've got ten bands, okay? Probably the luckiest band is the one in the middle. Because by the time the headliner comes on, everybody is worn out. But me, I'm happy with it. It's got its good things about it, it's got its bad things about it. So does being the headliner. The middle position? That's the perfect spot?

You know, what is the perfect spot? The perfect spot is to do the show on your own and have the place sold out and packed and everybody goes home happy and buys ten copies of each of your records. But that doesn't happen, so there you go. Just playing and the fact that we're still doing interviews and plus I'm gonna be writing jingles for your TV station

KTVU.com: That's right, I forgot! Just call me later. I'll try and set that up.

Rick Nielsen: Why not? I like to work. And I'll never be boring.